Would you be prepared to use photo ID…

[Jesss]

I’m not particularly bothered about the kind of thing in the blog posts. I currently don’t use my actual name on here, but if I felt it was worth it, then I could possibly show ID. I’ve already had to show ID to my mobile provider to turn off “safe search” and be allowed access to the forum here.

Ed likes this

[Jesss]

I’ve voted “possibly” because I wouldn’t really be bothered if the nudity was dropped — but I think I would share my ID privately with Ed. I’m already trusting him pretty seriously by sending in MDL entries!

Sue likes this

[Ed]

Sorry, I should have been clearer. I’m not going to require ID if there isn’t any nudity. The ID is so that nudity could be shown here (in a non-public part of the site).

[Since1980_v2]

<p style=”text-align: left;”>Already shared it for another site that required it.</p>

Ed likes this

[Jesss]

You were clear. I think I’m mainly saying thst I wouldn’t mind being a member who can’t see those posts. Like a free level Patreon supporter. Seeing them doesn’t do anything for me — but I suspect there would be more than just the odd photo attachment in that non-public area, so I would comply. I’m basically saying that I’m uncomfortable with the idea of voyeurism, and I’m a female with no interest in looking at this stuff.

Saying that – I have ended up sharing stuff myself. You’d get the ID. I’d just have some misgivings.

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[John]

Absolutely 🙂 indeed I feel we should campaign for a change to the law that all photo id pictures for over 18’s should be full length naked pictures 🙂

That would liven up the photo booth at Sainsburys, passport control, check 25 at the till and when the police ask for your licence. 🙂

I’m afraid that you will have to undress so that I can confirm your identity 🙂

Ed likes this

[Gary]

No problem at all.  With the array of Retailers being hacked, Ed having my photo id is fairly low risk

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[Steve]

Not a problem.

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[Ed]

We’re getting a suspiciously low rate (actually zero) of “No”s. Makes me wonder if something else is at play here.

[GeekFireball]

Would I give my ID here, yep, it’s harmless and I’m not overly bothered about someone pulling me out of a database and trying to blackmail me.  Also it’s going to be low on hackers radars.

Larger sites catering for actual porn, no way.

It is a bloody ridiculous law that every teenager will sidestep with a half decent vpn anyway.

Sue, Steve, Gary and 2 more people like this

[Jesss]

Yes — I feel safe here and you haven’t asked for ID before I got to know something about you.
Existing members are more likely to be willing, but new members may be different.

Ed likes this

[Jesss]

Bringing Ed’s comment over from elsewhere:

I don’t know how many people would be prepared to share a photo ID with an adult site. My research so far seems to put it at less than 25%, with some people being fiercely against it.

and replying:

This isn’t just any “adult site” and you are not an anonymous administrator.
That makes it easier.

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[Ed]

Thanks everybody!

[John]

I heard that Ed said that if he got 5 or more yes votes, he’d do all the dares himself and post them 🤣

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[Ed]

So, who would be willing to be checked on webcam (via Teams or Zoom or something like that)?

It would potentially allow us to verify your age, willingness to be naked and your sex, all in one. It would probably be a one-sided video chat to be honest, but I’m wondering what’s viable.

Sue and Steve like this

[ptHarry]

In principle, that sounds like a solution, though it’s not something I would consider doing for any other site.

The problem is in the detail. Teams and zoom are both operated by third parties, whose privacy policies are extremely unlikely to guarantee that only the two participants will ever see the images or other information about the connection.

It’s not something I’ve ever studied, but this really needs to be done via something from the Open Source community, where source code is available for experts to study to verify that connections are securely end to end encrypted and all processing is performed on our two computers, with no third party services used.

 

[Steve]

I would be happy to to do this.

[Gary]

I would be happy doing that

Would need to be before 9:00am when there’s only me in the house

[John]

Regretably due to the unlikelihood of getting everyone together at the same time, we probably wouldn’t be able to do a mass zoom, where we take turns to remove our clothes in front of the others and recite the nudity oath, but absolutely I would do a meeting 🙂

[Jesss]

Since I would actually be willing to sign up if you did one of the more traditional experiments, I suppose a webcam check is OK. But one sided I take it to mean that you don’t want to rurn your video on Ed? I’d prefer to see your face actually and know who is seeing me. This isn’t something you would be recording then? It’s a high level of trust you are asking.

[Ed]

I can appear on cam, but I am routinely within earshot of other people in the house (they would not be able to see my screen). I could hear you via headphones but I would not be able to talk (ie not have my mic on).

[Jesss]

Also something I would need an empty house for — or another location.
How soon would you be planning this? Once my daughter is back from uni in mid June, my privacy is gone!

[Jesss]

I’m actually going to suggest that you use me as a test case and get ahead of the game, because I will have an ideal opportunity to do this when not at home.
I’ll be meeting up with John (seasider) to go to the naked swim on Sunday 25th May. We’ve never met before, but I’ll be at his house from about 3pm until after 6. It would be the ideal opportunity for a video experiment with 2 participants!

I haven’t warned him what I’m trying to volunteer him for!

Ed and John like this

[Ed]

That sunday is difficult for me. The one before and the one after are both doable but that one is a birthday of one of my kids. The morning is totally impossible, but sometime between 3 and 6pm, I can maybe wrangle that.

[Jesss]

The date is because of the swim session. My husband knows I want to do that and I’ll be meeting up with someone (he doesn’t realise it’s a man I’ve never even met, but I feel I’ve exchanged enough messages to feel safe personally) and we want to leave for the swim session before 7pm I think. It would be interesting if we can arrange a few minutes to do this.
Family birthday I understand though, but I appreciate if you would creep away for a few minutes.
thanks

Ed likes this

[John]

I’d be up for that, though the house is a mess. If it isn’t doable, or Ed is not available, perhaps we could start a Thread Julie and John’s experiment, take experiment requests and we could try and film them being done,

Experiment only style requests please though, we are not a couple.

Ed likes this

[Jesss]

In wondering when Ed will see this and if it’s likely to be a possibility?

I’m up for video with Ed. Not so sure about video for posting on here. I’m still covering my face generally for fear someone actually knows me. Video adds voice recognition too and that’s a no.

Ed likes this

[Ed]

I have seen it 🙂

I’m happy to do video without sound. I can’t safely have my mic on anyway.

[John]

<p style=”text-align: left;”>I don’t think a face could be easily blocked on video, thinking about it, perhaps if Ed isn’t about we could take a mixture but just send pics or stills, or report on what happened.</p>

[Ed]

The simplest way to block a face on video is to wear a mask.

But, until anything is public, face covering isn’t really an issue.

[Since1980_v2]

Capcut and Inshot both have auto tracking of faces for free. Hiding faces is easy enough on recorded video live video is a bit more difficult. If the auto tracking doesn’t work you can use keyframe manually to put something over the face and then manually track it.

Would be very interesting to see how you get on.

@ed  I said a lot of times Im up for zoom or teams stuff to share ID.  I’ve done zoom with you before, it was open to anyone here but I think only you were able to join. I then Spent an hour in public, striping an item every couple of minutes before walking and  getting gradually further from my clothes based on time makes.

Ed likes this

[Jesss]

So where were you for that hour in public?

How public?

I wouldn’t fancy that challenge personally.

Sue likes this

[Since1980_v2]

The video recap talking about it go lost but here is the worst recap.

Zoom live public???

[Jesss]

Having read that recap, I realise people are different to each other.
I appreciate the urge to be naked, but I don’t understand what makes the rest of it attractive to you.
The basic debate about nudity is what got me into this site, but I don’t wish yo shoes myself in public. The date aspect of the MDL is initially not something I thought was for me, but I kind of wanted to join in.
The more of this more extreme stuff I read, the more I want to pull back and find a naturism site with less of the exhibitionism side on show.

[Since1980_v2]

Its probably more me than anyone else like that. I don’t want to drive anyone away it just detail some experiences of testing how comfortable I am being naked in different situations. I got hooked for a while on the dare side of things and tried a few different things. Some were riskier than others and provided that adrenaline rush some just gave that relaxation feeling of being free in public. Most stuff I’ve done while being public is a calculated public fo be placed ove checked lots of times and really only done at times people rarely visit.

I never want to be caught as such but I would like to be naked more in acceptable situations.

[Jesss]

Yes — it’s the “acceptable situations” bit.
I want to flout some of the social conventions, sometimes. I think it’s the ADHD in me rebelling, I never broke any rules as a kid and became too much of a conformer.
However, I think about what the people sat British Naturism events would find acceptable, and I don’t think it includes what you are describing. This site navigates the inbetween space.

[Since1980_v2]

and that’s where the boundaries for different people come in to play. Acceptable to me was so long as it is legal and not going to harm anyone if they do see anything.  I remember on the call Ed typing out and reminding me that it wasn’t illegal a few times.

What’s acceptable changes over time I guess. Would I repeat that one maybe maybe not I don’t know right now. Definitely not in that location as I know it’s busier now. I have other locations that challenge is still probably acceptable to me as a calculated risk.

 

what counts as acceptable to you is entirely up to you and you should definitely take a minute to think through anything before doing it. I definitely still have that bug to go and do more ‘dares’ and be more daring but now I’m looking in to how can do that in more expected places like the swims and walks with others but there will always be a little bit of me that wants to challenge myself to  other things.
I guess this site as a community gives ilia the opportunity to see bit side of the  acceptable in expected places and acceptable outside those spaces. You get to see read what others do and don’t do and set you own boundaries based on your own thoughts about it.

 

Ed likes this

[David]

If it’s submitted to a professional data protection third party yes, other wise no.

[Jesss]

I’m not sure exactly what a professional data protection 3rd party is exactly.

Ed likes this

[David]

National PASS app, Post Office Identity check service, etc

Photo id holds a vast amount of personal data.

[Ed]

First, I won’t be storing anything, apart from a check mark in a spreadsheet to say a person has been checked. Second, for pretty much all our members, I won’t require ID as most of us are decades older than 18.  Third, it’s entirely voluntary to gain access to one section of the community. Most of the forums, censored MDL, information, links, articles etc. etc. will all be outside the age-checked area, so that won’t require any kind of check anyway.

I’ve looked into the PO Identity Check Service. I’m waiting for them to get back to me on whether and how they charge for it. I’ve never heard of the National PASS app. I don’t know how to integrate the function of an app into WordPress? That will take more research. The online age checking services I have researched all seem to charge per check (whether they pass or not – so I still have to pay for all the failures with no income to cover it) or charge a monthly fee tiered by the number of checks I expect (which I don’t know, at all).

Based on user-feedback over the past couple of weeks, most people are much happier trusting me than a third-party body they don’t know.

[David]

Not trying to be picky, it’s a genuine concern. Is this site registered with ICO?

 

Probably best the rest if this conversation done via email or personal message.

[ptHarry]

<div id=”show_cache” contenteditable=”true” data-tc-id=”w-0.09569015864251929″>

@ed

I’m pretty sure there will be a charge for a PO identity check. Which actually may not even verify identity.

The service I’m thinking of is that PO will certify a photocopy of a document as being a true copy of an original. So, you can take in a document and a photocopy of that document, and they will stamp the document to say they’ve checked it is a true copy of the original. But there’s no attempt to verify whether the person requesting the certification is the person named in the document. Only that it’s a true copy of the original document.

If I remember correctly, I was charged an extortionate £7 for that, which was two minutes of work. The post office counter clerk was probably being paid little more than the National Minimum Wage, and therefore earning well over 1000% profit for the Post Office.

But the Post Office clearly doesn’t think that £7 was sufficiently extortionate as I see online they have raised the minimum charge to £12.50.

They’re also now saying that copyright prevents them from certifying copies of birth certificates — but a birth certificate isn’t proof of identity anyway. As far as I’m aware, there’s no restriction on buying an official copy of the  birth certificate of somebody else.

</div>

Ed likes this

[Ed]

The Post Office solution would only apply in the UK anyway, so I don’t think it’s a comprehensive solution.

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[ptHarry]

@Jesse @patreon_163722564 “I haven’t warned him what I’m trying to volunteer him for!”

Somehow, I think there’s a possibility he might guess 🙂

Ed likes this

[Jesss]

I’m just nosy about the data protection issue that David has raised:
As far as I can see at the moment, Ed is relying on Patreon doing all that. He’s not checked if we’re using false names, and he’s not storing addresses?
Using photo ID was supposed to be just to establish age? In the same way that you would show ID if asked when buying alcohol? And would likely not get asked once you are past 30 or so.
I think David raises a valid point, and Ed is likely to try to avoid getting dragged into the whole data protection mess if he can verify age without, but how do you prove that you did the age verification, without that creating a record that might become subject to data protection?

I’m glad it’s not up to me!

[Ed]

I don’t have to prove I checked it. What I need to prove is that I have a “robust” age verification system in place. If an inspector tests it, I’ll pass. If they ask me to describe it, it’s essentially the same as the one they use for alcohol, scissors, pharmaceuticals and glue. It’s the same as a barman checking ID. There has to be a system and, if it’s tested, it must work, but you don’t have to keep records of doing a check.

You can cover your name etc. on your photo ID. I’m unlikely ever to need to look at one, but if I do, I just need to see the photo, get a clear sense that the ID is genuine, and see the date of birth.I certainly won’t be taking down anything from the ID or keeping a copy of it.

[TheG]

Either trading standards or police – not sure which – send mystery shoppers to buy alcohol from local shops to make sure the shop is checking ages. The shop doesn’t keep a record of the check but does have to keep passing whatever audits get done.

Ed likes this

[John]

It’s trading standards, although there’s nothing to stop the police doing it. You also see customs etc occasionally search shops for knock off booze or fags.

The rest of you will have to wait and see, but plans are afoot regarding a potential small online/in person experiment.

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[Author]

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